924Board.org

[zokete]

I am new to this forum i have had my porsche for 4 months now, it is the best car i have ever owned. My problem is that the water pump is dying on me, is whining like crazy, and i want to replace it the only problem that i am having is that for my car (by the way is a 1987 porsche 924), there are three different types of water pumps and i don't know which one is the one that i need. second problem how hard is to change the water pump, should i just take it to a mechanic to do it for me, and last question if any of you has had this problem and send it to fix it how much are we talking about for the labor? thanks

[Khal]

Search for posts by gohim. I think he's covered this once or twice...
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'80 924 Turbo

[gohim]

Welcome,

From the sounds of it, your car needs what is called the "front of engine service". This service needs to be done every 30K miles, or 3 years, whichever comes first.

Khal is right, this topic has been explored over and over again every few weeks.

You can search the archives for more information. If you are going to do the work yourself, there is more to it, than simply unbolting the waterpumo, and replacing it. You should also replace the ball bearing equipped pulleys and rollers, the front of engine oil seals, and the timing and balance shaft belts besides the waterpump. I recommend using Genuine Porsche Parts for at least both belts. The specialized tools you will need to do this job yourself will cost between $600-$700, there are less expensive alternative tools if you are willing to take the risk. The parts are going to cost you between $600-$1000 depending on where you buy them, and whether you go with a new Genuine Porsche waterpump, or a rebuilt generic waterpump. Professional labor will cost $800-$1500 if you pay an experienced Watercooled Porsche Mechanic to do the work. YOU DO NOT WANT TO LET THE GUYS AT THE CORNER GAS STATION TRY TO REPLACE THE BELTS AND WATERPUMP.

[zokete]

Well, i didn't wanna sound so stupid, i didn't planned it to take it to the guy on the corner of the street, but i just want it to know how difficult would it be to take the parts apart and trying to put them together, besides for the tools that i was going to used. Thanks for your help guys i really appreciate for the time that you guys took to check my problem. I will let you know what I did to fix this problem, thanks again

[zokete]

When i look for the water pump to buy it, i have three options and are as follow:



To which engine range does the vehicle belong?

Up To: 01920
Up To: 61920
From: 01921

I have been looking like crazy in the manual and around the car engine and i do not find how can i get this number.

[Khal]

Sounds to me like you need a copy of PET, which is Porsche's electronic parts catalogue.

Someone posted a link to it in PDF format here on the 'board... do a search.

I have no idea which water pump you need but there are definitely people on the 'board who can give you the correct part number, which can no doubt be cross-referenced against aftermarket supplier part numbers (if there are any?).
It's probably been upgraded over time, so the original part number may not be the correct current one, which may be why you're getting several part numbers.

Be patient, someone who knows the part number will see this thread and get back to you.

gohim, do you know the part number?
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'80 924 Turbo

[gohim]

He must be looking at generic rebuilt waterpumps.

Porsche currently pretty much only offers the 951 compatible waterpump (you must use some adapter parts like the turbo cooling blockoff plate, if you have a NA, and buy the parts seperately for the belt guide if your old waterpump did not have one).

The auto parts store rebuilt waterpumps that are usually available generally fit the three following categories: #1 early waterpump without provision for the belt guide, #2 upgraded waterpump with provision for belt guide, and #3 upgraded waterpump with provision for belt guide and hole for turbo cooling hose.

I recommend adding the belt guide if your engine does not have one now. The parts do not cost that much. If you get stuck with the late/surrent 951 waterpump, the block off parts don't cost that much, and they are reusable, just like the belt guide parts.

I don't use any generic waterpumps (rebuilt or new). I only use Genuine Porsche waterpumps (both new and rebuilt). I usually get NOS (new old stock Genuine waterpumps from Authorized Porsche Dealers at the Pomona Swapmeet in the $80-$100 range. Sometimes, all I can find from the Dealer stands are the Porsche Rebuilt pumps and I can usually get them for less.

I don't recommend using the new generic waterpumps that are house marked by different companies. Most of them are made by a company by the name of LASCO, and are very poorly manufacture of inferior materials. The main shaft bearings that they use are incredible loose, right out of the box, and the basic body casting have many voids from poor casting process, leading to incomplete castings, and poor finish machining.

And I don't know about the part numbers. Generally, I just look at the waterpumps to make sure that they are brand-new, that they have the provisions for the belt guide, and I then take them.

The PET part numbers are useless if you are going to buy a rebuilt waterpump from a parts store.

The engine serial number on 87 and earlier 944/924S engines is found at the rear of the bolck on a casting tab below the flywheel sensor mounting bracket.

On 88 and later engines, the engine serial number will be found along the right side of the engine block.

[zokete]

Yeah, i saw those number too, what i was thinking on doing was that i was going to call to the porsche dealer here in vegas, and see what they offer me, i know that is the most expensive solution but right now i just want to make sure that i get the best part. You know it is kinda weird you guys tell me about water pumps in the 100's and the cheapest that i have found until now is about the 200 without the core. ( probably the ones that i have found are generic, thanks for the tip, and yeah i read the lasco was really crappy, i am staying out of that brand.)

[gohim]

Porsche is the only company who provides a 2 year unlimited mileage warranty on their replacement parts.

Porsche is also the only company that will stand behind their parts when there is a parts failure. I have read multiple accounts about how PCNA has paid for the parts and labor to replace a failed belt or waterpump, AND the other parts that were damaged along the way when the Genuine Part under warranty. PCNA paid the both the parts, and the labor.

Nobody else in the replacement parts business does that. Yeah, in many cases the generic parts are cheaper, but the way I see it, if the manufacturers of the parts will not show their faith in their products by offering a warranty to protect the Buyer, why should the Buyer have any faith in the quality of the products from the manufacturer?

Porsche waranties the parts for a specific period after that leave Porsche's warehouse. The 2-year warranty on parts from Porsche starts like 6-months (don't quote me on the exact time period) after the parts leave the warehouse, regardless of whether the Dealer has sold the part or not. This keeps Porsche and the Dealer Inventory Fresh. Dealers are allow to return a certain percentage (of the amount of inventory purchased) of normal stock inventory each period to Porsche.

Since the Dealer is responsible for the warranty any balance of the 2-year warranty not covered by Porsche, when Dealers get stuck with "stale" inventory, they often resort to liquidating old stock inventory at auto parts swapmeets or Porsche Club Gathering at an As-Is Price. Since the supply of these low cost parts in never stable or reliable, but the prices are usually very very reasonable, when I get the opportunity to buy parts this way, I bring home as much as I can with everything I have in my wallet.

One time I came home with over (50) intake and exhaust valves (primarily from 944, 928 and 931 engines for less than $5 a valve (cost at a Porsche Dealer is $75 to $100 each). I was only looking for 4-8 valves to hold to send to the machine shop with my 924S head, but the price was right and the potential for profit was great. At other times I have been offered brand new Genuine New Porsche waterpumps for $80-$100. I only need a new waterpump every (3) years for the front of engine service, but at that price I always take as many as I can find.

[Paul]

Always give your local dealer a chance to bid on whatever part you need. We need to support these guys so that Porsche will continue to have parts for our cars.

I always make a spreadsheet with the part numbers I need and each vendors price. Then I fax it to my Porsche parts guy and say: "Beat it!"

He usually does or comes close enough that the 2 year warranty makes it a no brainer.
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White 87 924S "Ghost"
Silver 98 986 3.6l 320 HP "Frank N Stein"
White 01 986 "Christine"
Polar Silver 02 996TT. "Turbo"
Owned and repaired 924s since 1977
Porsche: It's not driving, it's therapy.

[timstar92404]

3 water pumps? there should only be 2 types of water pumps, the old style before 86 which has no belt guard and uses a smaller roller and a new style with the guard which is what you probably have (not sure if a 924S would have the new pump) with larger roller.

any pump you get will fit you have to get the correct roller for it. Most people recommend getting the new style pump (951 pump with guard) but if you don't already have this intalled you have to cut your rear plastic cover to make it fit properly.

I just know the old pump part # starts with 944 and the new style 951.


tools aren't that expensive I ordered a Arnworx tool kit for $144 (pin spanner, flywheel lock, special wrench, kricket tensioning tool) with shipping. Other tools you need are a gear puller, basic wrenches, 24mm deep socket, breaker bar and a torque wrench that goes up to 155ft lbs for the crank bolt.

Also for parts, my previous owner has a receipt fromt a porsche parts place for $353 cdn which includes all belts/ rollers/ a rebuilt water pump old style.



oh and read the directions on www.Clarks-garage.com it's pretty clear.... I'm kind of scared to remove my water pump because I've read that it's likely that you'll break some studs even if you're careful and I know I'll be screwed if I break a stud.
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78 924 sold.
85.5 944

[timstar92404]

I think labour for a shop to do it is 8+ hours, not sure.

I can't say how hard it is, but from reading the instructions and looking at my car I'm guessing it's not crazy hard but it's definately not easy.

I'm going to do it myself (at least attempt to do it) and will find out how hard it is soon.
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78 924 sold.
85.5 944