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Rasta Monsta
Joined: 12 Jul 2006
Posts: 11733
Location: PacNW
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 Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2010 3:39 pm Post subject: Ceramic Exhaust Coatings |
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These coatings work, work, work, period. No brainer level, especially on a 931 (manifold, hotside, downpipe, if you please). Wow.
And if you also do your head (exhaust ports, valve faces, combustion surface) and pistons? Erg. . .
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Toofah King Bad
- WeiBe (1987 924S 2.5t) - 931 S3
Last edited by Rasta Monsta on Thu Jun 03, 2010 3:02 am; edited 1 time in total |
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ideola
Joined: 01 Oct 2004
Posts: 15550
Location: Spring Lake MI
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| Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2010 8:08 pm Post subject: |
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?  ?
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erstwhile owner of just about every 924 variant ever made |
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morghen
Joined: 21 Jan 2005
Posts: 9102
Location: Romania
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| Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2010 8:43 pm Post subject: |
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its normal to act like this....you know..the moments right before actually getting in and enjoying the fruits of your work...many strong man have lost controll and sprayed just moments before actually doing it 
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Supercharger and EFI kits
https://www.the924.com |
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Khal
Joined: 26 Sep 2003
Posts: 4872
Location: Sunny and lovely interior BC, Canada
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| Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2010 9:03 pm Post subject: Re: Ceramic Exhaust Coatings |
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| Rasta Monsta wrote: | | Work, work, work, period. |
Welcome to my world, Monsta.
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'80 924 Turbo |
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skemcin
Joined: 02 Sep 2003
Posts: 1284
Location: Plainfield, IL
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| Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2010 9:55 pm Post subject: |
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Does any of that heat (now that it's not escaping) do any harm being contained? The heat has to be channeled somewhere - so its either back up to the block (higher running temperature) or out the back (hotter exhaust) so are either subject to problems as a result? Or do the ceramics truly absorb the heat?
Interesting, nonetheless. I'm not sure if you posted a thread on the process - but did you DIY with something like this:
http://www.amazon.com/Techline-Ceramic-Exhaust-Coating-High-Temperature/dp/B001E6FLBW
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924.org (no time to complete)
9249206346 - 89k – new shifter bushings, belts, running well.
9249206347 - 8k – waiting its resurrection, no power at the fuel pump and fuse #7 blows w/power |
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Rich H
Joined: 10 Jun 2007
Posts: 2665
Location: Preston, Lancs, UK
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| Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2010 10:01 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | What's the difference between a duck?
One of it's legs is both the same. |
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1994 Lotus Esprit S4 - Work in progress...
1980 Porsche 924 S2 DITC Turbo - Original spec
1978 Homo-Sapiens - Tired spec
1953 Landrover S1 - Pensioner Spec |
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ideola
Joined: 01 Oct 2004
Posts: 15550
Location: Spring Lake MI
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| Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2010 10:09 pm Post subject: |
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| skemcin wrote: | | Does any of that heat (now that it's not escaping) do any harm being contained? The heat has to be channeled somewhere - so its either back up to the block (higher running temperature) or out the back (hotter exhaust) so are either subject to problems as a result? Or do the ceramics truly absorb the heat? |
Actually, it does the opposite of what you're thinking. The ceramic keeps the heat IN the gas so that it doesn't radiate or convect into the metals. This has two primary benefits: keeps the engine components themselves cooler, and keeps the exhaust gases moving as fast as possible (i.e. they escape faster!). On a turbo, this is particularly helpful since it's the exhaust gases that cause the turbine to spin; keeping the heat IN those gases helps with turbo spooling and theoretically reduces lag.
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erstwhile owner of just about every 924 variant ever made |
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skemcin
Joined: 02 Sep 2003
Posts: 1284
Location: Plainfield, IL
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| Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2010 10:18 pm Post subject: |
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| ideola wrote: | | skemcin wrote: | | Does any of that heat (now that it's not escaping) do any harm being contained? The heat has to be channeled somewhere - so its either back up to the block (higher running temperature) or out the back (hotter exhaust) so are either subject to problems as a result? Or do the ceramics truly absorb the heat? |
Actually, it does the opposite of what you're thinking. The ceramic keeps the heat IN the gas so that it doesn't radiate or convect into the metals. This has two primary benefits: keeps the engine components themselves cooler, and keeps the exhaust gases moving as fast as possible (i.e. they escape faster!). On a turbo, this is particularly helpful since it's the exhaust gases that cause the turbine to spin; keeping the heat IN those gases helps with turbo spooling and theoretically reduces lag. |
Ahh, I see. Thanks for the explanation. So this, ideally, is applied like a powder coating spray and back - I'm assuming.
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924.org (no time to complete)
9249206346 - 89k – new shifter bushings, belts, running well.
9249206347 - 8k – waiting its resurrection, no power at the fuel pump and fuse #7 blows w/power |
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ideola
Joined: 01 Oct 2004
Posts: 15550
Location: Spring Lake MI
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| Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2010 10:31 pm Post subject: |
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Did you mean "spray and bake"? If so, the answer is yes, the ceramics are baked on. I'm having my exhaust components ceramic coated inside and out, while the turbine will only be on the outside. The ceramics also prevent corrosion. I'll be doing the manifold, the j-pipe, the wastegate dump pipe at a minimum. I am also hoping to do the primary exhaust (that connects directly to the turbo) and the cat-delete section.
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erstwhile owner of just about every 924 variant ever made |
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skemcin
Joined: 02 Sep 2003
Posts: 1284
Location: Plainfield, IL
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| Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2010 11:18 pm Post subject: |
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back - bake - yes, I meant bake sorry for the typo.
Is this for the UWB or the 924CS?
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924.org (no time to complete)
9249206346 - 89k – new shifter bushings, belts, running well.
9249206347 - 8k – waiting its resurrection, no power at the fuel pump and fuse #7 blows w/power |
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ideola
Joined: 01 Oct 2004
Posts: 15550
Location: Spring Lake MI
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| Posted: Thu Jun 03, 2010 12:38 am Post subject: |
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| skemcin wrote: | | Is this for the UWB or the 924CS? |
Both The UWB manifold and turbine are already done. I have a pile of exhaust parts, enough for three cars, on my garage floor, waiting to go to the coaters. Now that I have the j-pipes back, I can run them over there to have the coating done.
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erstwhile owner of just about every 924 variant ever made |
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Rasta Monsta
Joined: 12 Jul 2006
Posts: 11733
Location: PacNW
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| Posted: Thu Jun 03, 2010 1:52 am Post subject: |
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During the cam break-in (which I feared was going to be thermal torture on the motor, 2000 RPM for 20 minutes!), the temp never got off the second mark, the cooling fans never came on, and the engine compartment was quite cool. And yes, there was substantial heat coming out of the tailpipe.
Later, when I was messing around with idle mixture, and checking under the car for leaks, the downpipe was cool to the touch, while the oil filter console was hot enough to burn you. It is working beautifully.
Dan, I would strongly encourage you to add "downpipe" to your "bare minimum" list. I think the downpipe radiates far more heat than the j-pipe, and will drastically reduce under hood temps when coated.
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Toofah King Bad
- WeiBe (1987 924S 2.5t) - 931 S3
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fiat22turbo
Joined: 18 Jan 2006
Posts: 4040
Location: Portland, OR
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| Posted: Thu Jun 03, 2010 2:29 am Post subject: |
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Huh?
The temp got up to the half-way mark and the fans did come on per normal. You then added coolant, which then brought the temp down a bit, which is also normal.
Keep in mind, the hood hasn't been reinstalled yet either and you had a fan pointed at the turbo from underneath.
I'm not saying the coatings don't work, but lets get a little more real-world data going here
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Stefan
1979 924 Carrera GTS (clone-ish)
1988 944 Turbo S (Silver Rose) |
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Rasta Monsta
Joined: 12 Jul 2006
Posts: 11733
Location: PacNW
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| Posted: Thu Jun 03, 2010 2:40 am Post subject: |
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OK, perfesser, I didn't recall the fans coming on. The point, though, is that an uncoated exhaust during that breakin exercise would likely have been glowing and radiating substantial heat, and they did neither.
Oh, and you'll be glad to know I drained the break-in oil as you suggested!
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Toofah King Bad
- WeiBe (1987 924S 2.5t) - 931 S3
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gegge
Joined: 27 Jul 2007
Posts: 1124
Location: Sweden
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| Posted: Thu Jun 03, 2010 2:47 am Post subject: |
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Interested to hear your views on DIY coating. I have Techline-coated the manifold, turbine housing, J-pipe and downpipe. Left the wastegate without "paint", it would be counterproductive considering the cooling fins.
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Carl Fredrik Torkildsen
924 turbo -81 Carrera GT RESTOMOD
924 turbo -80 Dolomite De Luxe
924 -85 DP kit, BBS RS, M030 and tuned engine
924s -86 Black on black turbo with Fuchs |
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