924Board.org

JoonTae · Joined: 24 Mar 2004 Posts: 42 Location: MS Gulf Coast

CBass has suggested an excellent engine swap. My parents want to know from other poeple that it will work(don't ask). I really want to do it they just want to get a couple more opinions. So would the swap be good? Anything else that I would have to do other than custom mounts and bellhousing like wiring stuff and what not? Thanks.

jamez · Joined: 03 Nov 2002 Posts: 401 Location: Chehalis, Wa

custom mounts, bellhousing/tranny, wiring stuff. hopefully there are other people on the internet or somewhere that know about the electrics in that specific engine. that should be just about it, the stock radiator might work. The motor should fit in the bay very easily. good luck, and just make sure you have patience and the gumption to get a job like this done before you start. keep us posted if you go ahead with it...

CBass · Joined: 03 Nov 2002 Posts: 2807 Location: Vancouver, Canada

The 4A-GZE mounts in almost exactly the same way as the 924, with the motor mounts right on the sides of the block.

The transverse installed 4A-GE motors, which the 4A-GZE is, have an interesting bellhousing design. The clutch is entirely housed in a sealed bellhousing, which has a large piece that comes off to house the differential, which you could just cut right off, leaving a nice compact bellhousing, which locates the clutch and starter for you.

There is a big flat surface where it could be milled flat, then all you would have to do is drill the 4 holes to mount the torque tube flange, and Bob's your uncle.

Cut the splined tip from a 4A-GE transmission off, and weld it onto the Porsche driveshaft, and it'll fit into the OEM Toyota clutch, and any aftermarket clutch for the 4A-GE.

A little info about the motor, the 4A-GZE is the japanese and australian spec supercharged 4A-GE. It's a 1.6 liter DOHC engine, with a roots type blower. They're very reliable, and can be fairly easily modified to make as much power as you could really ever want in a 2400lb car. The motor goes for around $650 from most engine importers.

The electrical work will probably take teh longest, but then again, it's pretty much the easiest part, it just takes forever. Since all the 924 engine electrics can be junkyed, except for the ignition, which can be used with the 4A-GZE. Then it's just a matter of using the toyota ECU and all of it's related sensors, and splicing the necessary wires together.
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'81 931 in various states of assembly

jamez · Joined: 03 Nov 2002 Posts: 401 Location: Chehalis, Wa

I wouldn't recomend welding the tranny output shaft to the porsche driveshft, its heat treated steel, you would need to take out the drive shaft have it welded and heat treated, it would be alot easier to just find a clutch disk with the right spline pattern and the right diameter, the stock 924 disk might even work.

CBass · Joined: 03 Nov 2002 Posts: 2807 Location: Vancouver, Canada

The downside is, then you're playing guessing games as to what is going to work, and the whole time the engine has to be out of the car, in a shop.

Also, with this method he can use OEM and aftermarket clutches for the 4A-GZE.
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'81 931 in various states of assembly

J1NX3D · Joined: 06 Feb 2003 Posts: 1333 Location: New Zealand

theyre good engines. theyre very common down here in NZ in toyota corolla levins and truenos, theyre both very common cars here.

check this link, this guy loves these engines: http://www.billzilla.org/4agstock.htm

and check here too: http://www.4age.net/

good luck!
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'86 944

leadfoot · Posted: Tue Mar 30, 2004 1:28 pm Post subject:

positives
the 90 model MR2 4AGZE engine is the more powerful than the earlier engine, 165hp as opposed to 145hp they upped compression to 9.8:1 to do this. BOV can be bypassed to run 10psi and a larger crank diameter from HSK will do the same.

negatives
That said why not just supercharge the 924 with the sc12 of the same engine...?? if your handy with the welder you can fab up mounts and use ems to manage the sc12 clutch and ignition/fuel.
Base cost to do this would be comprable to the cost of new engine, clutch/wiring loom, exhaust system and reconditioning of engine.
You might need to strengthen the drive tube.

That said go for it... i'd like to know the weight difference between the two engines, and consider going for the 1GGZE engine. It's a 2litre engine which would still be allowable for an insured engine swap as it is factory supercharged and displacement is no more than stock. It would also allow for alot more power down the road with a bit of headwork and sc mods.
Leadfoot

JoonTae · Joined: 24 Mar 2004 Posts: 42 Location: MS Gulf Coast

I'm probably going to twin charge the 4A-GZE engine eventually. And it would be sweet to have a unique car.

CBass · Joined: 03 Nov 2002 Posts: 2807 Location: Vancouver, Canada

JoonTae · Joined: 24 Mar 2004 Posts: 42 Location: MS Gulf Coast

Hey, thanks for everyones replies. I am most likely going \with the 4A-GZE swap since it will be my first and I want it to go fairly easily. I'm talking with a local guy her that's gonna help me out with the bell housing and mounts for it as soon as he takes a look at it. I need to talk with you Conner about a thing I can print up for him to check out tomorrow.
Thanks,
Derek

CMXXXI · Joined: 05 Nov 2002 Posts: 1939 Location: Vicksburg, MS

Derek,

I sorta hate to be the voice of reason here, but might you be thinking a bit ambitious here?

Your previous posts indicate that you've only a minimal amount of mechanical experience, no driver's license yet, and don't even know if you have the time needed to work on the car (regardless of an engine swap). Most everyone on the Board will probably agree that the 924 is a fairly straight forward vehicle on which to work (except for the CIS), but even still, one does need some experience and patience (and $$) to repair and maintain the car even in stock form.

You're talking about "the next level" (or two) beyond making a hot stock version of a legitimate antique car. By no means am I an expert on the subject, but I suspect that an untested engine swap is going to cost big, BIG bucks in the long run and is going to entail a very large amount of mechanical and electrical experience - hands on, technical and theoretical. Then there is the matter of obtaining parts for a now "hybrid" car and who knows how much custom fabrication work might be needed. Do you personally have access to a machine shop and welding equipment? Do you know how to use them? Do you know Ohm's law and Pascal's law? What about the effects of heat on materials when they are cut, machined, welded and/or brazed? Any mechanical or automotive engineering background? (Yes, I'm being a smart @ss, but you should understand the point of the questions.)

Oops, now you have a 'go-fast' car, you're going to need some 'stop-fast' brakes. That 5-bolt brake conversion isn't a huge mechanical endeavor, but by the same token it won't be an afternoon's walk in the park.

Oh, and did I mention that you'll need to whip out your checkbook just about every day for all this...?

Just trying to be realistic with you. My two cents...buy the car if you think it's in fair enough shape and you think can get it running right. But cool your jets until you get some time behind the wheel. The car isn't a road rocket by any means by todays standards, but it's a classic and will remain one. Gosh, you might just find you will enjoy how it drives/handles right out of the box.
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'79 Eurospec 931

Chrenan · Joined: 15 Jan 2003 Posts: 3903 Location: Canada

CMXXXI,

I can't agree more. I tried to gently make some of the same points in my earlier posts to Derek, but they seem to have been lost in a frenzy of engine swap discussions and other very ambitious plans. Derek, I can't stress this enough, if you are going to buy the 924, get it running correctly in its stock format. Once you are comfortable with that and have gained some experience, then start planning.

Just maintaining a Porsche, even a 924, can be an expensive proposition. If you really want the 4A-GZE, why not buy a car that came with that engine. The number of people who have successfully swapped an alternate engine into the 924 is not that high. Talk to PORSCHEV about it, he started his project in 1996 and is just nearing the end now, don't assume your attempt will be any quicker. Like CMXXXI, I don't want to sound like a bad-guy, but go into this thing with your eyes open, it is a MASSIVE undertaking.

Chrenan
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1987 951 - M193 Version for Japan

Lizard · Posted: Thu Apr 01, 2004 9:27 am Post subject:

thank you CMXXXI that was well put, (and you didnt make me be the one to say it

)

also CMXXXI, plz update your profile and add your website to it, thanx
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3 928s,

CMXXXI · Joined: 05 Nov 2002 Posts: 1939 Location: Vicksburg, MS

JoonTae · Joined: 24 Mar 2004 Posts: 42 Location: MS Gulf Coast

Oh I know this won't be that easy but I have someone who can help me out with most of the custom fabbing. I am taking the mechanics course as soon as the guy lets me in. He doesn't let anyone in who can't test drive the car legally. I can drive I just don't have a permit. I plan to get the 924 up and running first off. Then I plan to do some other stuff to it first. Sorry if I didn't mention this earlier I forgot what I had typed here and what I typed while talking with CBass. This guy that's going to help me with the custom fabbing is doing a Chevy engine swap into a 300Z. If I can't take the automotive class first I will probably take the Auto collision. What I was thinking of doing is I think I need a project car to get into this mechanics course so I was goingto get the 924 then work on it in class (if I don't buy a running 924). It will take some time yes I know I just want to plan ahead now so I can see what kind of budget I'm on spending wise and what not for the next 2 years to save up money for everything I want done with it.